source: trollforge/irc/wiki-logs/wikimedia.txt @ 654 Tweet

May 01 00:04:41 <Amgine>        Reports that Saif al-Arab may be killed in air raid.  http://aljazeera.com/news/africa/2011/04/2011430224755721620.html
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May 01 13:46:45 <Danny_B|backup>        does the foundation have any registration number, company identification number or something like that?
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May 01 13:50:04 <RoanKattouw>   In the US you mean? I assume so
May 01 13:50:11 <RoanKattouw>   You might find that on the 990 forms
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May 01 14:31:24 <Theo10011>     Danny_B|backup: did you find you an answer?
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May 01 14:32:55 <Danny_B|backup>        Theo10011: guillom pointed me to some documents mentioning "employer identification number" - so i suppose it is that. if you know about anything else, please let me know
May 01 14:33:01 <Theo10011>     WMF is a 501(c)3 non-profit organization.
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May 01 14:33:44 <Theo10011>     The registration paper are on WMF wiki, and they have a registration number.
May 01 14:33:49 <Theo10011>     http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/File:501(c)3_Letter.png
May 01 14:35:02 <guillom>       That's the document I linked to :)
May 01 14:35:17 <guillom>       That, and the latest Form 990.
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May 01 14:37:16 <Danny_B|backup>        am i blind or the "refistration number" is not there?
May 01 14:37:29 <Danny_B|backup>        what does "DLN" stand for?
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May 01 14:43:00 <effeietsanders>        Danny_B|backup: Dillon Airport, Drivers License Number or Digital Learning Network
May 01 14:43:17 <effeietsanders>        pick your favorite
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May 01 14:46:00 <Danny_B|backup>        apparently none of those in case of that 501c3 letter
May 01 14:47:10 <Danny_B|backup>        maybe document locator number?
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May 01 15:12:10 <subfr> hi, where can i get an up-to-date version of http://wikistics.falsikon.de/latest/wikibooks/fr/
May 01 15:12:35 <subfr> i want to see which page are most viewed on fr.wikibooks.org
May 01 15:12:41 <subfr> ?
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May 01 15:16:31 <effeietsanders>        subfr: try stats.grok.se
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May 01 15:45:18 <subfr> thank you effeietsanders but it tells me "Most viewed articles in 201012" if i go to http://stats.grok.se/fr.b/201105/
May 01 15:45:22 <subfr> :-(
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May 01 15:45:39 <subfr> so i don't know if the stats are up to date
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May 01 15:50:21 <effeietsanders>        subfr: doesnt sound too bad :)
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May 01 16:00:23 <subfr> effeietsanders, is there a way to know who are the referrers or the keywords used to find the content on google ?
May 01 16:00:48 <subfr> actually, i just need a full featured common stat tool :D
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May 01 16:04:42 <guillom>       There is none at the moment.
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May 01 16:52:33 <jeremyb>       Danny_B|backup: DLN is document locator # (99% certainty for your context): https://secure.ssa.gov/poms.nsf/lnx/0104602012
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May 01 16:59:36 <Danny_B|backup>        thx, jeremyb 
May 01 16:59:47 <jeremyb>       Danny_B|backup: wait a sec. what's that for?
May 01 17:00:28 <Danny_B|backup>        agreement
May 01 17:00:35 <Danny_B|backup>        so i used the EIN
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May 01 17:02:48 <jeremyb>       Danny_B|backup: EIN's probably right... there's also http://kepler.sos.ca.gov/cbs.aspx which says  C3162275 / C3093316 . i would check with vkessler or gbrigham (both @wikimedia.org)
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May 01 17:42:23 <RoanKattouw_away>      p
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May 01 18:34:40 <jeremyb>       Theo10011: i met guatam today, he's ~7 ft away now :) (never met him before and we ended up walking in the bldg front door together)
May 01 18:34:58 <Theo10011>     heh
May 01 18:35:03 <Theo10011>     I've never met him actually.
May 01 18:35:11 <jeremyb>       http://transparencycamp.org/sessions/62/
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May 01 18:38:00 <Theo10011>     Austin!
May 01 18:42:38 <dungodung>     Hair!
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May 01 18:55:24 <aude>  hi Austin 
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May 01 19:00:17 <Austin>        Hi
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May 01 19:17:22 <MC8>   Is there a toolserver interwiki? e.g. [[ts:luxo]] → toolserver.org/~luxo/ ?
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May 01 19:22:10 <Tanvir>        MC8, yeah, [[tools:~luxo]] will direct you to toolserver.org/~luxo.
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May 01 19:26:15 <Tanvir>        Additionally there are inter-wiki for widely used tools, [[sulutil:Example]] for http://toolserver.org/~vvv/sulutil.php?&user=Example and [[luxo:Example]] is for http://toolserver.org/~luxo/contributions/contributions.php?user=Example.
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May 01 19:27:22 <Gfoley4>       nice
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May 01 19:31:59 <MC8>   oooh
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May 01 23:30:22 <Sophiie>       hi, any foundation staff here?
May 01 23:30:50 <Jhs>   Sophiie, any in particular or just anyone?
May 01 23:30:58 <Sophiie>       anyone
May 01 23:31:04 <Sophiie>       dont mind who :)
May 01 23:31:06 <Jhs>   AlexZ_
May 01 23:31:29 <Jhs>   well, many, but i don't wanna ping them all :P
May 01 23:31:45 <Jhs>   i can pm you if you want
May 01 23:31:46 <Sophiie>       any what isnt away would help :)
May 01 23:31:55 <Sophiie>       Alex has been idle 41hrs
May 01 23:32:01 <Sophiie>       :(
May 01 23:32:16 <RoanKattouw_away>      Sophiie: It's Saturday, so probably no WMF staff around ;)
May 01 23:32:28 <Amgine>        Especially no WMF devs.
May 01 23:32:37 *       RoanKattouw_away is here
May 01 23:32:41 <Sophiie>       i thought it was sunday
May 01 23:32:44 <Sophiie>       :P
May 01 23:32:46 <RoanKattouw_away>      For about one minute before I go to bed
May 01 23:32:51 <RoanKattouw_away>      Dammit, you're right, it is Sunday
May 01 23:32:54 <RoanKattouw_away>      See, I need sleep
May 01 23:33:01 <Amgine>        Gnite Roan!
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May 01 23:33:26 <Amgine>        Sophiie: Generally it's better to just ask, unless it's something requiring serious privacy.
May 01 23:33:33 <Amgine>        Lots of non-staff may be able to help you.
May 01 23:33:38 <Sophiie>       it does involved pricicy
May 01 23:33:44 <Sophiie>       * pricacy
May 01 23:33:48 <Amgine>        Then talk to anyone but me.
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May 02 11:52:02 <Jhs>   kibble, you here? :)
May 02 11:52:41 <dungodung>     he's likely sleeping
May 02 11:52:47 <Jhs>   yeah, probably
May 02 11:52:57 *       dungodung hugs Jhs 
May 02 11:53:03 <Jhs>   :))
May 02 11:55:33 <Jhs>   dungodung, did you get the announcement i sent about the election? i sent it to a shitload of lists, but it was probably caught in a filter (because i sent it to a shitload of lists)
May 02 11:55:44 <Jhs>   i can't find it in any of the archives
May 02 11:55:57 <dungodung>     no, got none
May 02 11:56:15 <Jhs>   hmm
May 02 11:58:14 <Jhs>   they alle got rejected. that explains it. and gmail is a bitch, so it didn't tell me until i looked myself
May 02 12:01:09 <Jhs>   hmm, no mailing list for wikibooks. strange.
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May 02 12:02:53 <Jhs>   shoot, now i sent it to all the lists with "Re:" in the title. oh well.
May 02 12:03:06 <LeBron>        Fwd:
May 02 12:04:28 <Jhs>   Nah, I hit "reply all" to reinclude all of the addresses, and then just removed the quotation stuff, but Gmail automatically added the Re:
May 02 12:04:57 <LeBron>        I have a Fwd: but no Re:
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May 02 12:07:25 <Thehelpfulone> Jhs: do you have outlook?
May 02 12:07:25 <Jhs>   ah yeah, i forwarded it to internal and wmfcc
May 02 12:07:27 <Thehelpfulone> there's a button you press in outlook that re-sends it without any of the quote: send: time: and Re in the subject
May 02 12:07:28 <Thehelpfulone> I found out about it recently :D
May 02 12:07:48 <Jhs>   Thehelpfulone, nah, just Gmail interface
May 02 12:07:59 <Thehelpfulone> heh :)
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May 02 12:09:47 <dungodung>     Jhs: received :D
May 02 12:09:55 <Jhs>   great :D
May 02 12:10:45 <Jhs>   i was so careful to post it at exactly 00:01 UTC, was waiting up for more than an hour to do that. and then it turns out that it was autorejected. :/
May 02 12:10:55 <Jhs>   oh well, mission accomplished now
May 02 12:11:34 <dungodung>     :D
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May 02 16:06:25 <Sophiie[iPhone]>       Any foundation staff in here?
May 02 16:07:14 <guillom>       No.
May 02 16:07:57 <Sophiie[iPhone]>       Oh
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May 02 16:23:32 <GerardM->      it is only bishops, cardinals and popes who wear staffs
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May 02 16:24:58 <Sophiie[iPhone]>       Isn't a staff another name for a long stick?
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May 02 16:26:25 <Thehelpfulone> Sophiie[iPhone]: yes
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May 02 20:35:52 <jtrucks>       nsi sumanah
May 02 20:35:56 <jtrucks>       oops
May 02 20:37:15 <Pharos>        hi wikimedes
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May 02 21:06:04 <Amgine>        <taps dungodung politely on the shoulder>
May 02 21:06:23 <dungodung>     hi amgine :)
May 02 21:06:39 *       Barras is now known as [devil]
May 02 21:06:40 <Amgine>        Hiya! can you usurp a channel for us?
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May 02 21:07:07 <dungodung>     which one?
May 02 21:07:18 <Amgine>        #Wikinews-en-admins
May 02 21:07:35 <Amgine>        None of the f are currently admins, and none of the current admins have f
May 02 21:07:45 <dungodung>     have you tried contacting james?
May 02 21:07:55 <Amgine>        I think they have, but no response yet.
May 02 21:08:13 <dungodung>     ah, I remember having instructed someone to contact him about it
May 02 21:08:22 <Amgine>        <they're, typically, impatient> <laughs!>
May 02 21:08:24 <dungodung>     well, in that case, I guess I can usurp it ;)
May 02 21:08:49 <dungodung>     who do you think should have f?
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May 02 21:09:05 <Amgine>        Mmm, Blood Red Sandman, usual IRC nick is B-R-S
May 02 21:09:44 <dungodung>     alright
May 02 21:12:03 <Myra>  Abuse.
May 02 21:12:19 <Amgine>        <watches>
May 02 21:12:56 *       dungodung giggles
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May 02 21:20:30 <dungodung>     Amgine: done
May 02 21:20:59 <Amgine>        Whee! Thanks dungoung!
May 02 21:21:23 <killiondude>   Abuse.
May 02 21:21:48 <Amgine>        Is that a Shirleyism?
May 02 21:22:28 <Myra>  Do you want it to be?
May 02 21:22:35 <killiondude>   I think I started that. 
May 02 21:22:46 <killiondude>   It's difficult to tell anymore.
May 02 21:22:57 <dungodung>     :P
May 02 21:23:14 <dungodung>     why do people always misspell my nickname? :D
May 02 21:23:20 <killiondude>   dungdung
May 02 21:23:23 <Myra>  Tab-completion is hard.
May 02 21:23:29 <dungodung>     (and a better question: why don't they use tab-completion?)
May 02 21:23:37 <Myra>  I'm hard.
May 02 21:23:42 <dungodung>     kinky
May 02 21:23:44 *       FAdmArcher (~StarFleet@wikipedia/DeltaQuad) has joined #wikimedia
May 02 21:23:51 <Amgine>        Because my 'd' is sticky...
May 02 21:24:04 <Myra>  That's a euphemism.
May 02 21:24:04 <killiondude>   Oh my.
May 02 21:24:11 <dungodung>     yeah...
May 02 21:24:13 <Amgine>        <grins> 
May 02 21:24:21 <Nemo_bis>      dungodung, Amgine wants to fully enjoy the pleasure of spelling your name
May 02 21:24:35 <dungodung>     Nemo_bis: you're alive!
May 02 21:24:44 <killiondude>   RIP.
May 02 21:24:53 <dungodung>     <3
May 02 21:25:25 <Myra>  > "Oh, also ...," in text messages
May 02 21:25:28 <Nemo_bis>      more or less
May 02 21:25:30 <Myra>  What would that be?
May 02 21:25:39 <Myra>  Three letters.
May 02 21:25:52 <killiondude>   hey
May 02 21:26:04 <Amgine>        wut?
May 02 21:26:56 <Myra>  Both of those are silly answers.
May 02 21:27:00 <Myra>  I have NT_.
May 02 21:27:12 <Myra>  Though the N is questionable.
May 02 21:27:18 <killiondude>   btw
May 02 21:27:37 <Amgine>        sht I dno.
May 02 21:27:46 <Myra>  btw might work.
May 02 21:27:55 <killiondude>   y'think
May 02 21:27:56 <Myra>  It screws up "SHUN" going down, though.
May 02 21:28:02 <Myra>  > Social slight
May 02 21:28:06 <Myra>  S_UB
May 02 21:28:10 <Myra>  Hmmm.
May 02 21:28:12 <Myra>  Oh, snub.
May 02 21:28:22 <killiondude>   You're silly. 
May 02 21:28:33 <dungodung>     I have no idea what y'all are talking aboot
May 02 21:28:49 <Myra>  dungodung has been influenced by the Canada.
May 02 21:29:02 <killiondude>   NYT crossword puzzle.
May 02 21:29:09 <Myra>  How do you say "sea" in French?
May 02 21:29:13 <killiondude>   mar
May 02 21:29:14 <Myra>  It's not MAR?
May 02 21:29:15 <Amgine>        mar
May 02 21:29:18 <Myra>  Hmm,
May 02 21:29:19 <Amgine>        mer
May 02 21:29:27 <Myra>  Does MER also work?
May 02 21:29:35 <Myra>  I have it cross-sectioned with cat noise (MEW).
May 02 21:29:36 <killiondude>   yes.
May 02 21:29:38 *       Gfoley4 (~gordonfol@wikipedia/Gfoley4) has joined #wikimedia
May 02 21:29:38 <Amgine>         [[wikt:mer]]
May 02 21:29:39 <killiondude>   http://translate.google.com/#en|fr|sea
May 02 21:29:42 <Myra>  French is the worst.
May 02 21:29:44 <Myra>  No cheating!
May 02 21:29:55 <killiondude>   You're cheating at this very moment.
May 02 21:30:01 <Amgine>        And asking in chan is what?
May 02 21:30:03 <Myra>  PRove it.
May 02 21:30:05 <Myra>  Prove it.
May 02 21:30:10 <killiondude>   SHun.
May 02 21:30:13 <Myra>  Asking others you know isn't cheating.
May 02 21:30:24 <killiondude>   I know Google.
May 02 21:30:26 <killiondude>   In the biblical sense.
May 02 21:30:31 <Amgine>        <knows google translate intimately>
May 02 21:30:32 <Myra>  In the b... damn you.
May 02 21:30:47 <Myra>  The Cure was around in the 1980s?
May 02 21:30:51 <Amgine>        Yes
May 02 21:31:41 <Myra>  > Seabird
May 02 21:31:49 <Myra>  TER_
May 02 21:31:56 <Amgine>        tern
May 02 21:31:59 *       Alchimista (~Alch@wikipedia/Alchimista) has left #wikimedia ("Konversation terminated!")
May 02 21:32:01 <Myra>  Terp is a turtle, ters doesn't .. ah.
May 02 21:32:14 *       Myra circles that one.
May 02 21:32:45 <Amgine>        tern ? ternary : it's not
May 02 21:33:11 <Myra>  PRAWN makes more sense than CRAWS.
May 02 21:33:14 <Myra>  gj Myra
May 02 21:33:26 <Myra>  Greek goddess of strife is...
May 02 21:33:33 <Myra>  ERIS?
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May 02 21:33:34 <Amgine>        craws are (more commonly, US) freshwater.
May 02 21:33:38 <killiondude>   no
May 02 21:33:53 <killiondude>   oh maybe yes
May 02 21:33:59 <killiondude>   :(
May 02 21:34:14 <Myra>  > Handle roughly
May 02 21:34:18 <Myra>  _AWAT
May 02 21:34:32 <Myra>  Caw at?
May 02 21:34:42 <Amgine>        paw at
May 02 21:34:47 <Myra>  That works.
May 02 21:34:49 <killiondude>   gnaw at
May 02 21:34:57 <Myra>  killiondude: That wouldn't fit, silly.
May 02 21:35:06 <killiondude>   I like it better.
May 02 21:35:51 <Myra>  > Rocky hill
May 02 21:35:52 <Myra>  TO_
May 02 21:35:54 <Myra>  TOL?
May 02 21:36:03 <Myra>  Geography terms are the worst.
May 02 21:36:27 <Pharos>        i *love* geography terms
May 02 21:36:38 <killiondude>   The Sutter Buttes aren't really buttes
May 02 21:36:40 <killiondude>   !!!
May 02 21:36:51 <Myra>  Super butts.
May 02 21:37:14 <Amgine>        powerful fag ends.
May 02 21:37:28 <Myra>  Writer Anais
May 02 21:37:32 <Amgine>        Nin
May 02 21:38:30 *       guillom has quit (Quit: All this has happened before, and all this will happen again.)
May 02 21:38:31 <Myra>  Is "tol" a real word?
May 02 21:38:38 <Myra>  Let's say yes.
May 02 21:38:48 <Amgine>        Yes, 'tis
May 02 21:39:03 <Myra>  _O___OMELYCLEFT
May 02 21:39:16 <Myra>  Actor nominee for "From Here to Eternity"
May 02 21:39:22 <Amgine>        how many is that between O and O
May 02 21:39:27 <Myra>  Three.
May 02 21:39:42 <Myra>  Oh, it's TOW.
May 02 21:39:52 <Myra>  Wycleft makes more sense, doesn't it?
May 02 21:40:15 <Amgine>        something homely cleft...
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May 02 21:40:28 <Amgine>        probably related to the gluteal cleft.
May 02 21:41:02 <Myra>  > Mine, in Marseille
May 02 21:41:12 <Myra>  _MOI?
May 02 21:41:45 *       matanya (~matanya@wikimedia/matanya) has joined #wikimedia
May 02 21:41:56 <Amgine>        s'moi?
May 02 21:43:13 <Amgine>        no, Ã  moi
May 02 21:43:40 <Myra>  Go-___
May 02 21:43:48 <Myra>  K_R_
May 02 21:43:54 <Myra>  I keep thinking "FISH".
May 02 21:44:02 <Myra>  I also have "Go pro" in my head.
May 02 21:44:06 <killiondude>   karp
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May 02 21:44:10 <Myra>  kart?
May 02 21:44:14 <Amgine>        kart
May 02 21:44:29 <Amgine>        <trivial minds unite>
May 02 21:44:41 <Myra>  TOR?
May 02 21:44:55 <Myra>  MONTGOMERYCLEFT
May 02 21:45:41 <Myra>  All right.
May 02 21:45:45 <Myra>  Let's check it!
May 02 21:46:19 <Myra>  Oh, fuck.
May 02 21:46:21 <Myra>  CLIFT
May 02 21:46:45 <Amgine>        <chuckles>
May 02 21:46:48 <Myra>  Fuck me.
May 02 21:46:54 <Myra>  So close to a perfect puzzle.
May 02 21:46:58 <Myra>  I missed one.
May 02 21:47:46 <Amgine>        cheater.
May 02 21:47:53 <Myra>  Prove it.
May 02 21:48:02 <Myra>  HIFALUTIN
May 02 21:48:06 <Myra>  Not HIFALUTEN
May 02 21:48:10 <Myra>  FML.
May 02 21:48:15 <Amgine>        I had to look up 'mine' in my french text.
May 02 21:48:19 <killiondude>   You are quite possibly the worst. 
May 02 21:48:31 <Myra>  killiondude: Unsubstantiated.
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May 02 21:48:42 <Myra>  Goodbye, AntiSpamMeta.
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May 02 21:48:53 <Myra>  Goodbye, PeterSymonds.
May 02 21:50:08 <Myra>  AONE is a bullshit answer.
May 02 21:50:19 <Myra>  "Super-duper" was the clue.
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May 02 21:51:22 <killiondude>   I don't like the NYT crossword puzzles. 
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May 02 21:52:23 <Amgine>        <hates crosswords with multiword, contractions, without necessary punctuation.>
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May 02 22:12:54 *       Now talking on #wikimedia
May 02 22:12:54 *       Topic for #wikimedia is: Wikimedia <http://www.wikimedia.org/> | Status: Up | No public logging | Software questions? #mediawiki | Server issues? #wikimedia-tech | Op help? #wikimedia-ops | Steward help: #wikimedia-stewards | Toolserver: #wikimedia-toolserver
May 02 22:12:54 *       Topic for #wikimedia set by Logan_!~Logan_@wikipedia/Logan at Sun Mar 27 23:36:54 2011
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May 02 22:23:25 *       Topic for #wikimedia is: Wikimedia <http://www.wikimedia.org/> | Status: Up | No public logging | Software questions? #mediawiki | Server issues? #wikimedia-tech | Op help? #wikimedia-ops | Steward help: #wikimedia-stewards | Toolserver: #wikimedia-toolserver
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**** ENDING LOGGING AT Tue May  3 08:33:34 2011

**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Tue May  3 08:37:23 2011

May 03 08:37:23 *       Now talking on #wikimedia
May 03 08:37:23 *       Topic for #wikimedia is: Wikimedia <http://www.wikimedia.org/> | Status: Up | No public logging | Software questions? #mediawiki | Server issues? #wikimedia-tech | Op help? #wikimedia-ops | Steward help: #wikimedia-stewards | Toolserver: #wikimedia-toolserver
May 03 08:37:23 *       Topic for #wikimedia set by Logan_!~Logan_@wikipedia/Logan at Sun Mar 27 23:36:54 2011
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May 03 20:34:10 <jeremyb>       Danny_B|backup: did you get a final answer on the # to use?
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May 03 21:09:02 *       Myra eyes aude.
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May 03 21:10:44 <Theo10011>     creep.
May 03 21:11:03 *       jeremyb eyes Myra
May 03 21:11:26 *       Theo10011 eyes jeremyb and Myra
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May 03 21:18:46 <aude>  hi Myra 
May 03 21:20:24 <Myra>  aude: I assume you moderated your own message? :P
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May 03 21:21:48 <aude>  Myra: deleted it
May 03 21:21:56 <Myra>  ty!
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May 04 00:48:18 <Amgine>        Myra: I think we need to rename the google news sitemap extension... clearly there's a trademark infringement. So I think we should rename it Special:Bawulf: awesome wiki utilising-lists feed. Think it would work?
May 04 00:48:50 <Myra>  Do it, fgt.
May 04 00:48:57 <Amgine>        <grins>
May 04 00:49:03 <domas> 'Extension for Google News' 
May 04 00:49:11 <domas> is a good name trademark wise
May 04 00:49:31 <Amgine>        Yes, but Bawolff's Bawulf is eviler.
May 04 00:50:20 <Amgine>        <worked hard on that terrible pun>
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May 04 05:33:31 <killiondude>   Shakata|Home: Thanks. I would do that if the page weren't locked down.
May 04 05:33:51 <Shakata|Home>  killiondude: yea. I just happened to glance at it and notice it was... badly out of date
May 04 05:33:59 <Shakata|Home>  heck, the picture itself is, but that's a story for another day
May 04 05:34:59 <killiondude>   heh.
May 04 05:37:11 <killiondude>   btw, do you think the thumb graphic in the facebook "like" button could be pd-ineligible? 
May 04 05:38:30 <Shakata|Home>  pd-geometric yea
May 04 05:38:51 <Shakata|Home>  anything that can be displayed in 25px or less is generally pdgeo in my book
May 04 05:39:36 <killiondude>   ok, cool.
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May 04 06:16:18 <Amgine>        <wonders what Shakata|Home is doing>
May 04 06:16:29 <Shakata|Home>  Amgine: breaking FoundationWiki
May 04 06:16:44 <Shakata|Home>  the cool part about having OfficeIT powers is that I have god mode on all the cool wikiz
May 04 06:16:45 <Amgine>        I was more thinking about your earth salting.
May 04 06:16:50 <Shakata|Home>  oh, that?
May 04 06:16:59 <Amgine>        <grins>
May 04 06:16:59 <Shakata|Home>  just prevent the same page from being recreated a 5th time
May 04 06:17:07 <domas> shakata: you don't know what god mode is, apparently
May 04 06:17:08 <Shakata|Home>  4's the lucky number
May 04 06:17:14 <Shakata|Home>  domas: it's DBA access
May 04 06:17:17 <Amgine>        You're aware of title blacklist?
May 04 06:17:25 <Shakata|Home>  but I like the pretend to myself that I ahve power
May 04 06:17:29 <Shakata|Home>  I'm delusional like that
May 04 06:17:29 <domas> ok!
May 04 06:17:45 <Shakata|Home>  Amgine: why bother, hard protect an empty page that we'll never need anyways. Faster, easier... stronger
May 04 06:17:48 <Shakata|Home>  doesn't cost 6mil to upgrade
May 04 06:18:31 <Amgine>        title blacklist also prevents user accounts.
May 04 06:18:51 <Shakata|Home>  3 of the times were IP's, and 2 different ones at that
May 04 06:19:14 <Shakata|Home>  hard protect prevents Everyone!
May 04 06:19:21 <Amgine>        heh. Now you're going to make try to come up with *logical* arguments...
May 04 06:19:32 <Amgine>        Luckily I'm fresh out of logic.
May 04 06:20:05 <Shakata|Home>  meh, 6 of one, half dozen of the other me thinks
May 04 06:20:13 <Shakata|Home>  there are several ways to prevent the pages from being created
May 04 06:20:22 <Amgine>        <wonders if Bawolff has fixed the flaggedrevs explosions from GNSM on testwiki yet.>
May 04 06:20:31 <Shakata|Home>  I think he needed....
May 04 06:20:39 <Shakata|Home>  ...whom ever deployed the extesnion to do an svnupdate
May 04 06:20:57 <Amgine>        Mmm, that'd be ^demon. Who should be safely asleep by now.
May 04 06:21:07 <Amgine>        <checks clock> As should I, now I think on it.
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May 04 18:18:55 <Myra>  RoanKattouw: Did you ever get a chance to check on the status of broken section anchors in MW?
May 04 18:19:19 <RoanKattouw>   No?
May 04 18:19:25 <RoanKattouw>   I don't recall promising I would
May 04 18:19:32 <RoanKattouw>   Or even discussing it in this calendar year
May 04 18:19:55 <Myra>  Heh, we talked about it in here a few days ago.
May 04 18:20:02 <Myra>  rd_fragment specifically.
May 04 18:20:06 <RoanKattouw>   Oh
May 04 18:20:07 <Myra>  No worries, I'll poke at it.
May 04 18:20:09 <RoanKattouw>   That
May 04 18:20:20 <RoanKattouw>   I found out it works in trunk but not on 1.17wmf1
May 04 18:20:35 <RoanKattouw>   I made a note to find out why that difference exists, but didn't get around to it
May 04 18:20:38 <Myra>  Right, right. The field isn't populated or something. I need to file some bugs.
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May 04 18:20:57 <RoanKattouw>   All that needs to happen is find the rev that fixes it and tag it
May 04 18:21:22 <RoanKattouw>   You could SVN bisect it if you're up for that
May 04 18:21:27 <Myra>  Well, I'm a bit unclear on what was actually changed.
May 04 18:21:44 <Myra>  I mean, I know the column was added and it's supposed to be populated magically.
May 04 18:21:52 <Myra>  But is there UI support?
May 04 18:22:07 <RoanKattouw>   No, why would there be?
May 04 18:22:10 <Myra>  Integration with BrokenRedirects or a separate Special page or something?
May 04 18:22:12 <RoanKattouw>   It's really just a backend change
May 04 18:22:24 <Myra>  Right, but presumably you'd want to find the broken anchors.
May 04 18:22:45 <Myra>  I guess that's not why it was added originally, though.
May 04 18:22:48 <Myra>  It was about text retrieval.
May 04 18:23:21 <RoanKattouw>   Anchor redirects worked before
May 04 18:23:35 <RoanKattouw>   They way they're stored and retrieved changed slightly
May 04 18:25:12 <RoanKattouw>   Yes, and sanity
May 04 18:25:28 <RoanKattouw>   Not much reason for having a redirect table that only does half of what it's supposed to do
May 04 18:25:35 <Myra>  They worked until someone makes a slight change to the header.
May 04 18:25:40 <RoanKattouw>   Not so much re fragment but re interwiki prefix as well
May 04 18:25:41 <Myra>  And then they don't work as intended.
May 04 18:25:45 <RoanKattouw>   ? How?
May 04 18:25:53 <Myra>  == foo == --> == foo (bar) ==
May 04 18:25:58 <Myra>  And the anchor remains as #foo
May 04 18:26:02 <Myra>  I'm not sure how this is confusing. :P
May 04 18:26:11 <Myra>  There are thousands of broken anchors on en.wiki, etc.
May 04 18:26:12 <RoanKattouw>   That.... is not related to redirects at all
May 04 18:26:15 <Myra>  They're just a bitch to find.
May 04 18:26:28 <Myra>  Heh, well it is a bit.
May 04 18:27:15 <Myra>  I've been focusing on broken redirect anchors, though I guess there are anchors elsewhere.
May 04 18:28:21 <Myra>  Anyway, now that we're storing the fragment, it should be much easier to catch cases where #REDIRECT[[Foo#Bar]] doesn't work.
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May 04 18:29:13 <RoanKattouw>   Yeah you'll actually be able to find redirects to a given section
May 04 18:29:32 <RoanKattouw>   Right now redirects to [[Foo#Bar]] and [[en:Foo]] and [[Foo]] are all stored the same in the redirect table
May 04 18:29:47 <Myra>  Right.
May 04 18:30:16 <Myra>  I wrote <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Database_reports/Broken_section_anchors> with a database dump and some urlopen() magic.
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May 04 18:30:34 <Myra>  I originally wrote the script to use ?action=parse, but my goodness that shit is slow.
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May 04 18:36:46 <RoanKattouw>   action=parse can be slow depending on the precise usage
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May 04 18:37:22 <RoanKattouw>   If you use the page= parameter and no oldid= , it should be hitting the parser cache
May 04 18:37:31 <RoanKattouw>   Although of course nothing beats a response straight from the Squids
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May 04 18:42:56 <Myra>  I was using &text={{:article name}}__FORCETOC__&prop=sections, because that seemed like the most reliable way to get section names every time.
May 04 18:45:20 <RoanKattouw>   Righ
May 04 18:45:30 <RoanKattouw>   I fixed this at some point
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May 04 18:45:38 <RoanKattouw>   There should always be a section tree now
May 04 18:46:03 <RoanKattouw>   See http://en.wikipedia.org/w/api.php?action=parse&prop=sections&text====Foo===
May 04 18:46:04 <Myra>  Maybe not in 1.17wmf1? I read the API docs.
May 04 18:46:12 <RoanKattouw>   Then the docs are out of date
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May 04 18:47:14 <Myra>  > NOTE: Section tree is only generated if there are more than 4 sections, or if the __TOC__ keyword is present
May 04 18:47:29 <RoanKattouw>   ies
May 04 18:47:30 <RoanKattouw>   *Lies
May 04 18:47:38 <RoanKattouw>   To be fair I wrote that
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May 04 18:48:21 <Myra>  Is there always a section tree for &page= too?
May 04 18:48:25 <Myra>  That'd be convenient.
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May 04 18:48:37 <RoanKattouw>   Should be
May 04 18:48:52 <RoanKattouw>   Unless the parser  cache entry is extremely old but I don't think that can happen in practice
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May 05 02:08:54 <Amgine>        <whinges that android has fanbois who over-use #android, making the hash tag completely useless, then shuts up>
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May 05 02:59:30 <jorm>  Amgine: start making a bunch of PKD references to take it back.  "Does a #android dream of electric sheep?" etc.
May 05 02:59:39 <jorm>  actually.  gonna use that myself.
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May 05 17:00:56 <qdb>   hello. i am banned in wikipedia of my language because i have said words like "you are liar" in discussions. then i have been banned for 1 year because i have discussed through proxy. i hope i can complain on moderators and be unbanned.
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May 05 17:03:29 <Austin>        qdb: you can certainly do the former, but I wouldn't count on the latter. :)
May 05 17:03:53 <qdb>   Austin, where i can also complain?
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May 05 19:42:07 <Juandev>       hi
May 05 19:42:26 <Juandev>       are there any archives for the request of administratorship on meta?
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May 06 01:22:11 <YairRand_>     jorm: I'm not sure whether you saw the note I left on your talk page... do you normally use your WMF account and not your User:Jorm account?
May 06 01:22:36 <jorm>  i rarely, if ever, log into the Jorm account anymore.
May 06 01:22:51 <jorm>  so, i guess i did.
May 06 01:22:55 <jorm>  what's up?
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May 06 01:26:47 <YairRand_>     hm, if you don't use your nonWMF account, should I just repost it on your WMF talk page, or just talk here, or...
May 06 01:27:27 <YairRand_>     oh, I see you just did that
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May 06 01:29:39 <jorm>  yeah.
May 06 01:29:54 <jorm>  so, okay.  what this thing does is it kills the TOC, right? and then puts the languages in tabs.
May 06 01:30:07 <jorm>  right now they look just like links, sort of.
May 06 01:30:15 <jorm>  am i seeing the right thing?
May 06 01:30:20 <YairRand_>     yes
May 06 01:30:25 <jorm>  gg.
May 06 01:30:37 <jorm>  so, first, goodonye - this is already a massive step up, I think.
May 06 01:31:21 <jorm>  me likee.
May 06 01:31:26 <YairRand_>     :)
May 06 01:31:50 <jorm>  but i can see a few possible problems - especially if there are lots of translations.
May 06 01:32:21 <YairRand_>     you mean lots of language sections?
May 06 01:32:29 <jorm>  we were talking today at lunch about how we wish we had resources to spend on the sister projects.  i can come up with something for you, though, in my spare time.
May 06 01:32:31 <jorm>  yeah.
May 06 01:32:53 <YairRand_>     I think [[wikt:a]] has more sections than any other page
May 06 01:33:46 <jorm>  right.  holy smokes.
May 06 01:33:53 *       werdna waves
May 06 01:33:59 <jorm>  wernda++
May 06 01:34:06 <jorm>  hrm.  this is a sticky wicket.
May 06 01:34:23 <jorm>  my first instinct is to set them up like "side tabs"
May 06 01:34:33 <jorm>  so the tabs run vertically.
May 06 01:34:41 <jorm>  along the left hand side.   
May 06 01:34:48 <jorm>  but then we get into other localization problems.
May 06 01:34:55 <YairRand_>     And push the page over to the right?
May 06 01:35:15 <jorm>  are the language section names ever localized? 
May 06 01:35:21 <jorm>  yeah.  push it over by 100 pixels or so.
May 06 01:35:36 <jorm>  real-estate is not a premium on wikt pages, as far as i know.
May 06 01:36:04 <jorm>  hrm.
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May 06 01:36:15 <jorm>  lemme throw something together quick and dirty like for you.
May 06 01:36:20 <YairRand_>     umm, screen real-estate (if that means what I think it means) is very much valued on wikt pages
May 06 01:36:35 <YairRand_>     given that the current situation requires a whole lot of scrolling to get to a definition
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May 06 01:36:57 <jorm>  vertical real-estate is more valuable than horizontal real estate?
May 06 01:37:09 <YairRand_>     yeah
May 06 01:37:17 <jorm>  it seems to me that your solution solves for a lot of vert problems.
May 06 01:37:46 <jorm>  so maybe paying the piper with 100 or so pixels of horizontal will be fair.
May 06 01:39:01 <YairRand_>     the editing tools in the definition side boxes are a bit messed up in the current design
May 06 01:42:06 <YairRand_>     I came up with a different design for the editing options at User:Yair rand/editor2.js, but I'm not sure it's really an improvement
May 06 01:42:56 <jorm>  sec.  gimme a few.
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May 06 01:59:10 <jorm>  YairRand_: I'm still here; working on a comp for you.  My girlfriend just got home, though, and we're chatting.
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May 06 02:22:07 <jorm>  YairRand_: I've got something.  uploading to commons now.
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May 06 02:24:42 <jorm>  YairRand_: http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:WiktionaryTabs-Design.png
May 06 02:25:01 <jorm>  viola! 30 minutes.
May 06 02:25:09 <jorm>  i can work on it some more later.
May 06 02:25:11 <YairRand_>     nice :)
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May 06 02:26:43 <YairRand_>     you're going to work on it more later? so should I wait before changing the script to look like that?
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May 06 02:27:45 <YairRand_>     and are you also going to make some designs for the definition editing options things?
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May 06 02:31:18 <Amgine>        YairRand: GNSM is now in testing on test.wiki.
May 06 02:31:34 <Amgine>        Soon you will have a more flexible feed.
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May 06 02:33:08 <jorm>  well, i can possibly look at it more later.  go ahead and start with that.
May 06 02:33:16 <jorm>  changes i make would likely be colors, etc.
May 06 02:33:42 <jorm>  and the definition editing options bit i haven't looked at.
May 06 02:33:47 <YairRand_>     okay
May 06 02:34:15 <jorm>  i'll try to find some time but i'm super busy until i head to berlin on wednesday.
May 06 02:34:36 <jorm>  (i have to paint an apartment and i have, like, three birthday things to deal with this weekend)
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May 06 13:21:34 <arkiaz>        Hi, where can i get sample programmes with wikimedia api in python? 
May 06 13:22:18 <Theo10011>     Try asking in #wikimedia-tech
May 06 13:22:32 <arkiaz>        thanks
May 06 13:22:49 <Theo10011>     np. 
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May 06 22:05:11 <killiondude>   Harder. 
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May 06 22:41:17 <Zuzak> Who should one notify over legal issues? enwikinews has a deletion request open for their general disclaimer
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May 06 22:45:13 <neilk_>        Zuzak: what
May 06 22:45:18 <neilk_>        Zuzak: that's ridiculous
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May 06 22:48:16 <Zuzak> neilk_: hence the need for wmf
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May 06 23:01:44 <neilk_>        Zuzak: I don't think the RfD will go through, but if you feel you need to alert someone, I can give you the email address of our general counsel
May 06 23:02:11 <Zuzak> Well, it's always good to get some perspective, etc
May 06 23:02:19 <Zuzak> It's an interesting point they've raised
May 06 23:05:52 <GerardM->      Zuzak what is the URL ?
May 06 23:06:40 <Zuzak> http://en.wikinews.org/wiki/Wikinews:Deletion_requests#Wikinews:General_disclaimer_Wikinews:TLDR
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May 07 05:39:04 <Amgine>        <pokes Kibble>
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May 07 10:54:39 <Rock_drum>     Is there a full version of the founding principles somewhere? The version on meta says it's abridged...
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May 07 12:56:43 <Theo10011>     hello.
May 07 12:58:26 <Rock_drum>     hi
May 07 12:58:42 <Theo10011>     Hey Rock_drum
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May 07 13:15:52 <Theo10011>     Hey Pharos
May 07 13:16:04 <Pharos>        hi theo
May 07 13:16:07 <Rock_drum>     hi
May 07 13:16:22 <Pharos>        i am attending the fouding of Wikimedia DC today :)
May 07 13:16:27 <Pharos>        *founding
May 07 13:16:31 <Theo10011>     oh wow
May 07 13:16:34 <Rock_drum>     founding? Cool!
May 07 13:16:40 <Rock_drum>     Have they been officially approved?
May 07 13:16:40 <Theo10011>     Congratulations :)
May 07 13:17:33 <Pharos>        no, but they'll apply soon
May 07 13:17:54 <Pharos>        today is their first official meeting and they'll get their first officers
May 07 13:18:11 <Theo10011>     Aude and a couple of other people were working on the bylaws all last week.
May 07 13:18:13 <Rock_drum>     My money's on aude being chair
May 07 13:19:47 <Pharos>        i will not bet against you!
May 07 13:19:48 *       Rock_drum is now known as Rock_drum|AFK
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May 07 13:20:28 <Theo10011>     yup, If I had a vote, she'd have it.
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May 07 13:24:40 <Theo10011>     Hey aude
May 07 13:25:48 <_sj_>  you mean the founding of Wiki Society of DC, Inc. :)
May 07 13:26:26 <Pharos>        well, yes
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May 07 13:26:30 <Theo10011>     really? is that the official term?
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May 07 13:26:51 <Pharos>        they decided that should be the official name for name
May 07 13:27:14 <Pharos>        when they are approved, they will start calling themselves "Wikimedia DC"
May 07 13:27:29 <Pharos>        "official name for now"
May 07 13:27:40 <Theo10011>     ahh 
May 07 13:28:05 *       wing2 has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
May 07 13:28:33 <_sj_>  Rock_drum - where does the 'founding principles' page say it is abridged?
May 07 13:30:24 *       Disconnected (Remote host closed socket).
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Sat May  7 13:30:24 2011

**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat May  7 13:31:08 2011

May 07 13:31:08 *       Now talking on #wikimedia
May 07 13:31:08 *       Topic for #wikimedia is: Wikimedia <http://www.wikimedia.org/> | Status: Up | No public logging | Software questions? #mediawiki | Server issues? #wikimedia-tech | Op help? #wikimedia-ops | Steward help: #wikimedia-stewards | Toolserver: #wikimedia-toolserver
May 07 13:31:08 *       Topic for #wikimedia set by Logan_!~Logan_@wikipedia/Logan at Sun Mar 27 23:36:54 2011
May 07 13:41:55 *       Pharos has quit (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86.1 [Firefox 3.6.17/20110420140830])
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May 07 13:44:20 *       Beria is back (gone 12:17:53)
May 07 13:44:56 <Theo10011>     Beria! :)
May 07 13:45:11 *       wikiblue has quit (Quit: wikiblue)
May 07 13:46:13 <Beria> hi Theo :D
May 07 13:47:25 <Rock_drum|AFK> How do chapters decide what to call themselves, formally.
May 07 13:47:31 <Rock_drum|AFK> Like Wiki France Ltd.
May 07 13:47:36 <Rock_drum|AFK> Rather than Wikimedia France?
May 07 13:47:39 *       Rock_drum|AFK is now known as Rock_drum
May 07 13:47:52 *       DragonFire_aw (~DragonFir@Wikinews/DragonFire1024) has joined #wikimedia
May 07 13:48:00 <Theo10011>     Depends on the legal jurisdiction and registration from country to country.
May 07 13:48:57 <Beria> they need to have "Wikimedia + Country" according with the Chapters - WMF agreement
May 07 13:49:03 <Rock_drum>     Yes
May 07 13:49:10 <Rock_drum>     But that's often not the legal name
May 07 13:49:21 <Beria> in Portugal's case is
May 07 13:49:24 <Rock_drum>     They'll Trade as that, actually be called something elsse
May 07 13:49:31 <Beria> Associação Wikimedia Portugal
May 07 13:49:34 <Beria> that is the official name
May 07 13:49:58 <Theo10011>     Unofficially Beria's chapter.
May 07 13:49:59 <Theo10011>     ;)
May 07 13:50:08 <Beria> is my chapter
May 07 13:50:15 <_sj_>  many chapters incorporate under a different name than 'wikimedia X'.  that way they can incorporate before becoming a chapter.
May 07 13:50:25 <Beria> not mine as "i'm the dictator there" but is mine
May 07 13:50:33 <_sj_>  they can choose any name they like... 
May 07 13:50:34 <Rock_drum>     _sj_: Are youc oming to GLAMcamp?
May 07 13:51:07 <Rock_drum>     *you coming
May 07 13:51:28 <_sj_>  definitely
May 07 13:51:35 <Rock_drum>     Cool!
May 07 13:52:05 <_sj_>  making some progress with the MIT video archives; I hope we'll have something to show off by then
May 07 13:53:33 <Rock_drum>     Excuse the shameless plug but... *coughs* http://outreach.wikimedia.org/wiki/GLAM/Newsletter *coughs*
May 07 13:53:34 <Rock_drum>     :P
May 07 13:54:56 <Theo10011>     That page design looks conspicuously familiar? 
May 07 13:55:14 <Theo10011>     Is that the Signpost template Rock_drum?
May 07 13:55:22 <Rock_drum>     I... borrowed it
May 07 13:55:33 <Rock_drum>     I'll give it back, don't worry! :p
May 07 13:55:38 <Theo10011>     haha it looks cool.
May 07 13:55:48 <Theo10011>     ya Haeb won't mind I think.
May 07 13:56:02 <Rock_drum>     He knows
May 07 13:56:13 <Rock_drum>     He steals stuff from it for the Signpost
May 07 13:56:21 <Rock_drum>     I steal his stuff for this month in GLAM
May 07 13:57:16 <Theo10011>     ahh the circle of Plagiarism.
May 07 13:57:30 <Rock_drum>     It's sort of this mutual disrespect for each other's content XD
May 07 13:57:46 <Theo10011>     I would've thought Mono would have customized it by now. :)
May 07 13:58:01 *       PM|AFK (Pmlinedite@wikimedia/pmlineditor) has joined #wikimedia
May 07 13:58:01 <Rock_drum>     Nah, he's an ACIP sort-of-guy
May 07 13:58:08 <Rock_drum>     I focus on GLAM stuff mainly
May 07 13:58:40 <Theo10011>     Nice, it looks real good. :)
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May 07 13:58:54 <Rock_drum>     Please subscribe. :)
May 07 13:59:02 <Theo10011>     Will do.
May 07 14:00:36 <Theo10011>     brb
May 07 14:06:08 *       effeietsanders waves at _sj_
May 07 14:12:15 <Theo10011>     Hola effeietsanders.
May 07 14:12:31 <effeietsanders>        hey, Theo10011 
May 07 14:12:34 <effeietsanders>        how is life?
May 07 14:12:46 <Theo10011>     Ah same ol' :)
May 07 14:12:50 <Theo10011>     how about you?
May 07 14:13:02 <effeietsanders>        warm :P
May 07 14:13:11 <effeietsanders>        well, for our standards
May 07 14:13:36 <effeietsanders>        some 25C
May 07 14:14:06 <Theo10011>     You wanna see warm it's over 35C here and the summer isn't even in full swing yet.
May 07 14:14:16 <Theo10011>     40C plus expected soon.
May 07 14:14:22 <effeietsanders>        hehe
May 07 14:14:29 <effeietsanders>        i dont need that much warmth
May 07 14:14:30 <Theo10011>     Now do you feel better?
May 07 14:14:32 <effeietsanders>        25 is just fine
May 07 14:14:37 <Theo10011>     hehe
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May 07 14:14:57 <effeietsanders>        i want to be able to move without drowning the country in sweat
May 07 14:15:11 <Theo10011>     lol
May 07 14:15:28 <effeietsanders>        good i see you here btw
May 07 14:15:40 <effeietsanders>        do you happen to know where the minutes are located for our second berlin meeting?
May 07 14:15:45 <effeietsanders>        the one on sunday
May 07 14:16:00 <Theo10011>     I didn't see them on mr wiki
May 07 14:16:02 <effeietsanders>        have been looking for them a few times, but couldn't locate them - they are not yet linked on meta
May 07 14:16:22 <effeietsanders>        oyeah, mrwiki... I keep forgetting about that one
May 07 14:17:05 <Theo10011>     ya I didn't see them either.
May 07 14:17:25 <effeietsanders>        :(
May 07 14:17:29 <Theo10011>     http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Movement_roles_project/Current_players_and_their_roles
May 07 14:17:38 <Theo10011>     I am looking at this now.
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May 07 14:18:27 <effeietsanders>        yeah
May 07 14:18:28 <effeietsanders>        images like this are tricky
May 07 14:18:31 <effeietsanders>        lots of arrows missing
May 07 14:18:39 <Theo10011>     It's also a lot to go through.
May 07 14:18:58 <Theo10011>     text-wise.
May 07 14:20:03 <Theo10011>     _sj_: do you know where the notes from the Berlin meeting are located?
May 07 14:21:01 <effeietsanders>        i thought sj made them on some etherpad
May 07 14:21:19 <effeietsanders>        oh, i have to do some shopping before i forget
May 07 14:21:20 <_sj_>  morning effe
May 07 14:21:29 <effeietsanders>        its saturday :(
May 07 14:21:32 <_sj_>  etherpad it is
May 07 14:21:35 <effeietsanders>        bbl in 30 min or so
May 07 14:21:36 <Theo10011>     ya and Asaf took old-fashioned notes too.
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May 07 14:21:55 <eiaway>        (sorry sj, it is not because of you :P )
May 07 14:21:59 <_sj_>  easy to forget on saturday?  oh, stores close early :)
May 07 14:22:11 <eiaway>        yeah, and in a town, not a city
May 07 14:22:12 <_sj_>  that's like stores not being open on sunday in my old town...
May 07 14:22:35 <eiaway>        well, rather that it is mothers day tomorrow ;-0
May 07 14:22:37 <eiaway>        ;-)
May 07 14:22:41 <eiaway>        here in europe
May 07 14:22:47 <Theo10011>     oh
May 07 14:22:49 <_sj_>  :) here too.  see you soon
May 07 14:22:56 <dungodung>     we don't have that here
May 07 14:23:35 <Theo10011>     mother's day!?
May 07 14:24:40 <dungodung>     yeah
May 07 14:24:54 <dungodung>     we have mothers, though
May 07 14:25:47 <Theo10011>     heh
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May 07 14:53:15 <_sj_>  theo: see also http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Movement_roles_project/Roles_Matrix#Models_for_shared_responsibility
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May 07 14:54:37 <effeietsanders>        _sj_: about the notes, could you add them to meta / link them / whatever?
May 07 14:56:53 <effeietsanders>        because the fact that they are somewhere on an etherpad doesn't help hugely ;-)
May 07 14:57:21 <_sj_>  they're linked from the main top of the MR page
May 07 14:57:34 <_sj_>  http://eiximenis.wikimedia.org/MovementRolesBerlinMarch2011
May 07 14:57:45 *       _sj_ wonders if there's an etherpad plugin for searching open notes
May 07 14:58:02 <effeietsanders>        oh, i usually like the fact that they are hidden
May 07 14:58:03 <_sj_>  top of the main*  :)
May 07 14:58:06 <effeietsanders>        just not when i need them :P
May 07 14:58:19 <_sj_>  it would be nice to be able to flag a note as 'public' 
May 07 14:58:22 <_sj_>  which would make it searchable
May 07 14:59:22 <effeietsanders>        well, there's public and public :P
May 07 14:59:24 <effeietsanders>        but yeah
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May 07 15:01:15 <effeietsanders>        _sj_: are you OK if I copy it to meta?
May 07 15:01:21 <effeietsanders>        the connection keeps falling away here...
May 07 15:01:31 <effeietsanders>        (wont do markup for now)
May 07 15:03:01 <effeietsanders>        oh, and btw, that is only the Thursday discussion
May 07 15:03:06 <effeietsanders>        not the one on Sunday
May 07 15:03:11 <effeietsanders>        which I was looking for actually
May 07 15:04:19 <Theo10011>     do you mean the one after the  conference wind-up on sunday afternoon?
May 07 15:04:29 <effeietsanders>        yes
May 07 15:04:36 <effeietsanders>        I remember I promised some things there
May 07 15:04:40 <effeietsanders>        but wasnt able to find what
May 07 15:04:44 <effeietsanders>        although I could guess
May 07 15:04:59 <Theo10011>     ah I think there wasn't enough for notes, but Asaf was taking some if I recall.
May 07 15:05:15 <Theo10011>     ya we all decided to focus on certain aspects.
May 07 15:06:09 <effeietsanders>        sj was typing too, but not entirely sure if they were notes
May 07 15:07:23 <_sj_>  yes, better to have the text on meta
May 07 15:07:53 <_sj_>  <checks for sunday>
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May 07 15:22:34 <effeietsanders>        hmm, the Goma page is interesting
May 07 15:22:43 <effeietsanders>        but there are some misconceptions in it, it seems
May 07 15:24:17 <Theo10011>     I saw several things that I wanted to comment on.
May 07 15:24:32 <Theo10011>     To begin with he's chosen some abstract players for the diagram.
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May 07 15:28:26 <effeietsanders>        I'm just editing it boldly :P
May 07 15:28:35 <Theo10011_>    So is Beria. :)
May 07 15:28:40 <effeietsanders>        to at least correct the largest misconceptions :P
May 07 15:28:41 <Theo10011_>    she should join in, if she wants.
May 07 15:28:48 <effeietsanders>        Beria: poke :p
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May 07 15:29:10 <Beria> join what?
May 07 15:29:17 <Theo10011>     the discussion.
May 07 15:29:27 <Beria> which one?
May 07 15:29:43 <effeietsanders>        Beria: I think we had an edit conflict regarding chapcom :P
May 07 15:30:10 <effeietsanders>        I took the liberty of overwriting your edit, please check if mine also fixes your issues (i think it does, but please check)
May 07 15:30:22 <effeietsanders>        because Goma has a point that chapcom is not living up to expectations
May 07 15:30:24 <Beria> ok let me see :D
May 07 15:30:45 <effeietsanders>        at least not to mine :P
May 07 15:31:25 <effeietsanders>        the Thursday notes are now on http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Movement_roles_project/Working_group_meeting_2011-3-24 btw
May 07 15:31:54 <Theo10011>     and who's editing without loggin in, was that _sj_?
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May 07 15:33:19 <effeietsanders>        where?
May 07 15:33:36 <Theo10011>     http://meta.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Movement_roles_project&curid=300769&diff=2550550&oldid=2547358&rcid=2541749
May 07 15:34:10 <effeietsanders>        sounds like sj
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May 07 15:35:08 <_sj_>  effe: Asaf was taking notes, mine were high level.  people committed to working on one of the targets 
May 07 15:35:08 <_sj_>  http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Movement_roles/targets
May 07 15:35:36 <effeietsanders>        where is [edit] Support to internal tasks of the Board coming from? :S
May 07 15:35:54 <effeietsanders>        is that a description or what he would like to see?
May 07 15:36:09 <Theo10011>     oh that target page is a great idea _sj_
May 07 15:36:17 <Theo10011>     I didn't see that one before.
May 07 15:37:35 <_sj_>  please pick one to work on - it would be good to have draft recommendations for each that we can discuss
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May 07 15:41:47 <Theo10011_>    BTW there has been no activity on mr wiki
May 07 15:41:49 <Theo10011_>    for over a month
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May 07 15:41:50 <_sj_>   <yes, that was me editing>
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May 07 15:42:00 <_sj_>  that's bc we decided to make all discussion public on meta
May 07 15:42:27 <Theo10011>     ah I remember.
May 07 15:42:31 *       _sj_ is allergic to private wikis
May 07 15:42:37 <effeietsanders>        wow
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May 07 15:42:54 <effeietsanders>        you must be totally flooded with red spots when you visit the office then
May 07 15:43:29 <effeietsanders>        Theo10011: I put a comment on the talkpage about Movement_roles_project/Current_players_and_their_roles#Support_to_internal_tasks_of_the_Board
May 07 15:43:29 <_sj_>  only when people are using the office wikis in front of me ;)
May 07 15:43:39 <effeietsanders>        hopefully someone is able to clarify
May 07 15:43:49 <effeietsanders>        maybe I am just stupid and I forget something obvious :)
May 07 15:44:09 <Theo10011>     there are way too many wikis already.
May 07 15:44:15 <effeietsanders>        sj: it is supposed to be support of the board, does the paragraph ring any bells with you?
May 07 15:45:14 <_sj_>  that whole section is a listing of current committees
May 07 15:45:37 <effeietsanders>        yes, but is there such a committee?
May 07 15:45:40 <_sj_>  It looks like that subset is being categorized as 'board committees supporting internal foundation work'
May 07 15:45:51 <_sj_>  electcom, nomcom, auditcom
May 07 15:45:53 <effeietsanders>        "6 members
May 07 15:45:55 <effeietsanders>        2 of the Council
May 07 15:45:56 <effeietsanders>        2 volunteers of the communities
May 07 15:45:58 <effeietsanders>        1 member of the consultive Board
May 07 15:45:59 <effeietsanders>        1 The Executive director"
May 07 15:46:08 <_sj_>  that's the standing definition of nomcom.
May 07 15:46:12 <effeietsanders>        oh, wait
May 07 15:46:14 <_sj_>  unfortunately, it is currently not in use
May 07 15:46:15 <effeietsanders>        that is the nomination committee...
May 07 15:46:33 <Theo10011>     there is also this recommendation...
May 07 15:46:37 <Theo10011>     "Increasing the weight of the members of the board chosen by the communities. For example 5 from the communities + 2 from chapters and organizations + 2 elected by the board it selves + 1 the founder."
May 07 15:46:50 <_sj_>  something of a sore point with me... 
May 07 15:46:57 <effeietsanders>        yeah
May 07 15:47:04 <effeietsanders>        I have been wondering about that in the past 
May 07 15:47:15 <Theo10011>     I really thought he was going way beyond the scope of this group.
May 07 15:47:24 <Theo10011>     We really should get back to Sue's email.
May 07 15:47:25 <_sj_>  the current definition of how nomcom-equivalent nominations happen is vague
May 07 15:47:31 <_sj_>  theo: definitely.  maybe move that recommendation to the talk page?
May 07 15:47:38 <Theo10011>     will do.
May 07 15:47:41 <_sj_>  feel free to edit that page - it's just the outcome of one group
May 07 15:48:00 <_sj_>  discussion about current roles
May 07 15:49:20 <effeietsanders>        Theo10011: to be honest, I dont think that Sue's email is particularly helpful as discussion material for most people
May 07 15:49:24 <effeietsanders>        it is just too long
May 07 15:49:54 <Theo10011>     effe but we decides on addressing the recommendations in the email on the Sunday meeting.
May 07 15:50:02 <_sj_>  effe: a group working on that should boil it down to a short set of observations and recommendations
May 07 15:50:07 <Theo10011>     we even went through some one by one, if you recall.
May 07 15:50:19 <effeietsanders>        Perhaps it is better to find the topics that it is really about, and then get everybody's input on that
May 07 15:50:32 <_sj_>  we should get parallel input from each of the groups on the targets page
May 07 15:50:55 <effeietsanders>        yes, I agree the topics could be addressed, I just am not too sure Sue's email is a great basis for that due to its length :)
May 07 15:50:59 <_sj_>  (even if just a couple paragraphs about what is important to them and what they would like to see in the future)
May 07 15:51:13 <_sj_>  right.  maybe start linking to the boiled-down ten-point version once it exists?
May 07 15:51:33 <effeietsanders>        at the same point the length was important, because it showed what her assumptions were
May 07 15:51:46 <Theo10011>     yup, we should def. focus on the boiled-down ten point version.
May 07 15:51:52 <effeietsanders>        some of which were miscommunications perhaps
May 07 15:53:01 <Theo10011>     http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Movement_roles_project/Sue_Gardner%27s_input_on_Movement_Roles_Project
May 07 15:53:05 <Theo10011>     that's Sue's email.
May 07 15:53:35 <Theo10011>     8 recommendations at the end under recap section.
May 07 15:54:09 <Beria> i never read that
May 07 15:54:11 <Beria> too long
May 07 15:54:16 <Theo10011>     hehe
May 07 15:54:25 <Beria> someone make a "This page in a nutshell" please :P
May 07 15:54:42 <effeietsanders>        Theo10011: point 2) and 3) is what it is all about i guess
May 07 15:54:56 <effeietsanders>        and 2) is kind of useless for us, because the discussion is happening outside us already
May 07 15:55:26 <effeietsanders>        but 3) is very broad though :P
May 07 15:55:36 <_sj_>  btw, so we don't flood this chan...  there is also #wikimedia-roles for the more detailed discussions
May 07 15:55:45 <effeietsanders>        why not? ;-)
May 07 15:55:46 <Theo10011>     effe: there's also a couple of things that could be very easily addressed in brief, Asaf and Abbas settled on some global south related stuff too.
May 07 15:56:02 <effeietsanders>        its not like it is heavily used 
May 07 15:56:13 <Theo10011>     I'm already there.
May 07 15:56:18 <Theo10011>     if effe wants to join....
May 07 15:56:27 <effeietsanders>        I meant, why not just discuss here
May 07 15:56:33 <effeietsanders>        if we want to be open and involve people
May 07 15:56:37 <effeietsanders>        we got Beria involved :P
May 07 15:57:01 <Theo10011>     I'll force Beria in #wikimedia-roles. ;)
May 07 15:57:22 <Beria> I involved in what?
May 07 15:57:26 <Beria> Movements roles?
May 07 15:57:33 <effeietsanders>        Beria: in this discussion ":0-
May 07 15:57:35 <effeietsanders>        :)
May 07 15:57:40 <Beria> i already gave a interviewn 
May 07 15:57:40 <Theo10011>     ya, too late you're already involved.
May 07 15:57:43 <Beria> i did my part ;)
May 07 15:57:57 <Theo10011>     there's more work to be done.
May 07 15:58:12 <Beria> like?
May 07 15:58:24 <Theo10011>     in #wikimedia-roles
May 07 15:58:28 <Beria> there are a group doing that right?
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May 07 16:22:38 <_sj_>  hey emijrp - have you seen the en:wp discussion about archiving external links?
May 07 16:24:33 <emijrp>        _sj_: mmm, there were several, which on? i started a BRFA but it is stopped, people asked some things about manual of style, etc, and it derailed a bit
May 07 16:24:42 <emijrp>        one*
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May 07 16:30:42 <emijrp>        although a BRFA is needed, i think that we need to start archiving links in webcitation, later we will add the archived links into {{cite web}}, but if we wait for the approval (this bot or any in the future), we are wasting time and error404 does not stop
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May 07 17:09:44 <_sj_>  emijr: see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Requests_for_comment/Archived_citations_2
May 07 17:09:51 <_sj_>  we should have a discussion like this on meta for all projects
May 07 17:10:03 <_sj_>  emijrp*
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May 07 19:57:01 <Hedgehog456>   Who should I contact if I have suspicions of finding a virus on the WM servers?
May 07 20:04:43 <Barras>        the server admins?
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May 07 20:05:46 <Platonides>    Hedgehog456, #wikimedia-tech
May 07 20:05:51 <Platonides>    although I find it unlikely
May 07 20:06:01 <Hedgehog456>   Platonides: Ah, OK. I did
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May 07 20:24:01 <BarkingFish>   Eveninig :)  If I want to request clarification on something at meta, i.e, I disagree with a decision that's been taken somewhere, where do I put the request to have it reviewed?
May 07 20:27:12 <BarkingFish>   anyone?
May 07 20:28:47 <Tanvir>        BarkingFish, is it a local community problem?
May 07 20:28:59 <BarkingFish>   it's local to meta, yes.
May 07 20:29:36 <BarkingFish>   I'll explain, and you may be able to point me where I need to post to enquire about it.
May 07 20:29:47 <Tanvir>        Okay. Go on then.
May 07 20:30:45 <BarkingFish>   I was looking at a local wiki I admin, and found links to someone's global pages being removed, thinking they'd retired I went to meta to look at their page, and found a request for bureaucratship linked on it.  I went to vote in it, and found it had been shut *way* too early.
May 07 20:31:25 <BarkingFish>   My understanding is requests should stay for at least 7 days, according to the requests page. This one was open for about 12 hours and closed as successful, which I think isn't quite within the lines of what should happen.
May 07 20:32:40 <BarkingFish>   I wanted to ask for the close to be clarified, just wanted to know where to ask about it.
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May 07 20:34:37 <Tanvir>        BarkingFish, steward request?
May 07 20:34:52 <Tanvir>        The crat request was to stewards?
May 07 20:34:56 <BarkingFish>   no, it was done through the local procedure
May 07 20:35:26 <Tanvir>        Then it is upto local policy, though we disagree..
May 07 20:35:47 <Tanvir>        But you can open a request for comment though.
May 07 20:35:53 <Tanvir>        See [[m:RFC]]
May 07 20:36:18 <BarkingFish>   I'll link you to the request I'm referring to. The local policy states 7 days for requests
May 07 20:36:20 <BarkingFish>   http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Meta:Requests_for_bureaucratship/Mentifisto
May 07 20:36:53 <BarkingFish>   opened 8.45pm UTC 6th april, closed ±14h later
May 07 20:37:09 <PeterSymonds>  It isn't seven days on Meta.
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May 07 20:37:29 <BarkingFish>   Requests should be listed here for at least seven days; bureaucrats should only close after this minimum time.
May 07 20:37:32 <PeterSymonds>  It's auto-promote when two bureaucrats endorse, and when there have been no objections until then.
May 07 20:37:48 <BarkingFish>   ah, ok. The starting page doesn't note that.
May 07 20:37:52 <Tanvir>        Ah, BarkingFish, you go your answer now. :)
May 07 20:38:07 <Tanvir>        Oi PeterSymonds, how are you?
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May 07 20:38:18 <PeterSymonds>  Well thanks! How are you?
May 07 20:38:32 <BarkingFish>   It doesn't state that it's an auto promotion, or I wouldn't have questioned it :)
May 07 20:38:43 <PeterSymonds>  Hmm, it should be.
May 07 20:38:54 <PeterSymonds>  Barras will fix it.
May 07 20:38:55 <BarkingFish>   That needs noting on the section, since the rulings on that page don't tally otherwise
May 07 20:39:07 <Tanvir>        PeterSymonds, fine. :)
May 07 20:39:19 <BarkingFish>   PeterSymonds: all it shows is:
May 07 20:39:20 <BarkingFish>   Bureaucratship
May 07 20:39:20 <BarkingFish>   Add your request below under the bureaucratship section. Please note:
May 07 20:39:20 <BarkingFish>       * only active administrators can become bureaucrats, and only after 6 months of regular adminship
May 07 20:39:20 <BarkingFish>       * User is endorsed by two current bureaucrats after he/she nominates themselves here
May 07 20:39:21 <Barras>        :?
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May 07 20:39:44 <PeterSymonds>  Oh I see.
May 07 20:39:47 <BarkingFish>   there is another page where I'd assume the auto promotion thing is clarified
May 07 20:39:55 <BarkingFish>   but it's not there.
May 07 20:40:18 <Barras>        WM:B says something about it
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May 07 20:41:34 <BarkingFish>   yeah, I see it now.  It still looks like it was closed early though, by about 10 hours
May 07 20:41:56 <BarkingFish>   http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Meta:Bureaucrats#Requirements
May 07 20:42:25 <BarkingFish>   * No objections are raised in 24 hours after he/she nominates themselves at Meta:Requests for adminship. 
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May 07 20:42:45 <Barras>        BarkingFish: meta is not a content project and we trust our crats
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May 07 20:42:57 <Barras>        if there is enough support, the flag is simply given out
May 07 20:43:06 <BarkingFish>   0.0
May 07 20:44:02 <Barras>        4 crat endorses are more than enough.
May 07 20:45:02 <BarkingFish>   some of the guides need updating then. If I'd had all that when I posted here, I'd never have questioned it.  One page says one thing, which is contradicted somewhere else, and then somewhere else again.
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May 07 20:45:24 <BarkingFish>   I gotta go for a bit, been called away
May 07 20:45:37 <BarkingFish>   see ya later guys, sorry for the bother.
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May 07 23:32:01 <_sj_>  wb matanya
May 07 23:32:29 <matanya>       hi _sj_ 
May 07 23:35:45 <jgay>  _sj_, heya
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May 08 00:45:25 <_sj_>  jgay :)
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